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	<title>Comments for Analogical Thoughts</title>
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	<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com</link>
	<description>Faltering Attempts to Think God&#039;s Thoughts After Him</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 00:54:38 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on Responses to The God Delusion by Critical Reviews of Richard Dawkins&#8217; &#8220;The God Delusion&#8221; : Thinking Matters Talk</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/04/05/responses-to-the-god-delusion/#comment-198</link>
		<dc:creator>Critical Reviews of Richard Dawkins&#8217; &#8220;The God Delusion&#8221; : Thinking Matters Talk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Nov 2009 00:54:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=203#comment-198</guid>
		<description>[...] Also, for those interested in getting a hold of books that have addressed Dawkins&#8217; book and the New Atheism, here are a few options (HT: James at Analogical Thoughts): [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Also, for those interested in getting a hold of books that have addressed Dawkins&#8217; book and the New Atheism, here are a few options (HT: James at Analogical Thoughts): [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Inverted Phariseeism by metochostouchristou</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/inverted-phariseeism/#comment-197</link>
		<dc:creator>metochostouchristou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 21:22:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=407#comment-197</guid>
		<description>Great points.  Thanks for posting this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great points.  Thanks for posting this.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Inverted Phariseeism by James</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/inverted-phariseeism/#comment-196</link>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 22:31:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=407#comment-196</guid>
		<description>Ouch! See how easy it is? :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ouch! See how easy it is? :)</p>
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		<title>Comment on Inverted Phariseeism by stephennhays</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/inverted-phariseeism/#comment-195</link>
		<dc:creator>stephennhays</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 22:01:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=407#comment-195</guid>
		<description>God, I thank you that I&#039;m not like other Calvinists who vainly imagine they&#039;re justified by their faith in justification by faith!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>God, I thank you that I&#8217;m not like other Calvinists who vainly imagine they&#8217;re justified by their faith in justification by faith!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Inverted Phariseeism by theoparadox</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/inverted-phariseeism/#comment-194</link>
		<dc:creator>theoparadox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Oct 2009 21:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=407#comment-194</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s convicting and well put. Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s convicting and well put. Thanks.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Scripture or Science? by James</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/08/scripture-or-science/#comment-193</link>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Oct 2009 01:10:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=390#comment-193</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comment. I agree that this is an important distinction, but I&#039;m not sure how it bears on the point I made. My point was simply that recognizing the low probability of some state-of-affairs with respect to &lt;i&gt;scientific evidence alone&lt;/i&gt; (whether evidence about natural laws or evidence about what happened in the past) needn&#039;t defeat a person&#039;s belief that the state-of-affairs has obtained. It&#039;s a general point about probability and epistemic defeaters which doesn&#039;t depend on the kind of scientific evidence in view. But that&#039;s not to deny, as you point out, the relevance of the distinction in other contexts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comment. I agree that this is an important distinction, but I&#8217;m not sure how it bears on the point I made. My point was simply that recognizing the low probability of some state-of-affairs with respect to <i>scientific evidence alone</i> (whether evidence about natural laws or evidence about what happened in the past) needn&#8217;t defeat a person&#8217;s belief that the state-of-affairs has obtained. It&#8217;s a general point about probability and epistemic defeaters which doesn&#8217;t depend on the kind of scientific evidence in view. But that&#8217;s not to deny, as you point out, the relevance of the distinction in other contexts.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Scripture or Science? by James</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/08/scripture-or-science/#comment-192</link>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Oct 2009 01:02:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=390#comment-192</guid>
		<description>Yes, it turned out a lot longer than I intended! But it was a good opportunity to articulate my thoughts on the issue, so thanks again for the question.

As to your first point, my qualified skepticism about scientific consensus is based partly on my view of the noetic effects of sin, as you suggest, but also on an understanding of human psychology that would be shared by many non-Christians. In short: it&#039;s human nature to be inclined toward interpretations and conclusions that (i) fit with one&#039;s personal outlook on life and (ii) fit with the expectations of one&#039;s community.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, it turned out a lot longer than I intended! But it was a good opportunity to articulate my thoughts on the issue, so thanks again for the question.</p>
<p>As to your first point, my qualified skepticism about scientific consensus is based partly on my view of the noetic effects of sin, as you suggest, but also on an understanding of human psychology that would be shared by many non-Christians. In short: it&#8217;s human nature to be inclined toward interpretations and conclusions that (i) fit with one&#8217;s personal outlook on life and (ii) fit with the expectations of one&#8217;s community.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Scripture or Science? by iohannes325</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/08/scripture-or-science/#comment-191</link>
		<dc:creator>iohannes325</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Oct 2009 01:22:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=390#comment-191</guid>
		<description>Fascinating discussion. The ASA had a panel on Adam at its conference over the summer; audio recordings are available at the website (Symposium II). I look forward to reading Prof Collins&#039; paper when it becomes available.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fascinating discussion. The ASA had a panel on Adam at its conference over the summer; audio recordings are available at the website (Symposium II). I look forward to reading Prof Collins&#8217; paper when it becomes available.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Scripture or Science? by matthewdschultz</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/08/scripture-or-science/#comment-190</link>
		<dc:creator>matthewdschultz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 23:45:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=390#comment-190</guid>
		<description>Dr. Anderson, this was excellent.  Very useful and helpful.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dr. Anderson, this was excellent.  Very useful and helpful.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Scripture or Science? by jugulum</title>
		<link>http://proginosko.wordpress.com/2009/10/08/scripture-or-science/#comment-189</link>
		<dc:creator>jugulum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Oct 2009 22:35:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://proginosko.wordpress.com/?p=390#comment-189</guid>
		<description>Thank you very much for this in-depth response.  It seems very solid.  I agree with 99%

However, I want to critique the examples you chose in #12.  You&#039;re failing to make an important distinction--a distinction that is &lt;i&gt;frequently&lt;/i&gt; overlooked by Christians discussing these issues.  (I&#039;m not sure whether this matters to the specific point you were making, but I do believe it&#039;s an important consideration--and it&#039;s one that deserves attention in such an in-depth discussion of the issues.)

Specifically:
&lt;blockquote&gt;From a purely scientific point of view, the probability that the Red Sea parted when Moses raised his staff is extremely low;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
In one sense, that&#039;s true.  In another sense, science says absolutely nothing about whether the Red Sea parted when Moses raised his staff.

There is scientific evidence about how the universe works.  It tells us that there is no natural way for such a thing to happen.  And Christians agree with that conclusion.  (The same goes for floating axe heads and resurrections.)

That&#039;s about &lt;b&gt;evidence pointing to natural law&lt;/b&gt;.

On the other hand, there is scientific evidence about what has happened in the past.  In that category we have distant starlight, paleontology, radioisotopes, or the evolutionary lines of argument you mentioned--biogeography &amp; comparative genetics.  This is where non-theistic evolutionists tend to disagree with the general consensus.  (I think I would also include evidence about what&#039;s happening in the &lt;i&gt;present&lt;/i&gt;, but in places we can&#039;t directly observe or easily control--like observations of the center of the earth, or most astronomy.  It&#039;s not identical, but it&#039;s similar.)

That&#039;s about &lt;b&gt;evidence pointing to what happened.&lt;/b&gt;  Like forensics.

Science tells us that resurrections don&#039;t happen in natural law, but it doesn&#039;t suggest anything about Christ&#039;s resurrection, in the &lt;i&gt;forensic&lt;/i&gt; sense.

And usually, when Christians go old-earth or theistic-evolutionist, it&#039;s usually because of what they perceive in the forensic scientific evidence about what actually happened.  They&#039;re comparing their interpretation of Scripture&#039;s testimony about what happened, with their interpretation of what the physical evidence tells us about what happened.

Scientific evidence about natural law doesn&#039;t even &lt;i&gt;apparently&lt;/i&gt; contradict Scriptural testimony about what happened.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you very much for this in-depth response.  It seems very solid.  I agree with 99%</p>
<p>However, I want to critique the examples you chose in #12.  You&#8217;re failing to make an important distinction&#8211;a distinction that is <i>frequently</i> overlooked by Christians discussing these issues.  (I&#8217;m not sure whether this matters to the specific point you were making, but I do believe it&#8217;s an important consideration&#8211;and it&#8217;s one that deserves attention in such an in-depth discussion of the issues.)</p>
<p>Specifically:</p>
<blockquote><p>From a purely scientific point of view, the probability that the Red Sea parted when Moses raised his staff is extremely low;</p></blockquote>
<p>In one sense, that&#8217;s true.  In another sense, science says absolutely nothing about whether the Red Sea parted when Moses raised his staff.</p>
<p>There is scientific evidence about how the universe works.  It tells us that there is no natural way for such a thing to happen.  And Christians agree with that conclusion.  (The same goes for floating axe heads and resurrections.)</p>
<p>That&#8217;s about <b>evidence pointing to natural law</b>.</p>
<p>On the other hand, there is scientific evidence about what has happened in the past.  In that category we have distant starlight, paleontology, radioisotopes, or the evolutionary lines of argument you mentioned&#8211;biogeography &amp; comparative genetics.  This is where non-theistic evolutionists tend to disagree with the general consensus.  (I think I would also include evidence about what&#8217;s happening in the <i>present</i>, but in places we can&#8217;t directly observe or easily control&#8211;like observations of the center of the earth, or most astronomy.  It&#8217;s not identical, but it&#8217;s similar.)</p>
<p>That&#8217;s about <b>evidence pointing to what happened.</b>  Like forensics.</p>
<p>Science tells us that resurrections don&#8217;t happen in natural law, but it doesn&#8217;t suggest anything about Christ&#8217;s resurrection, in the <i>forensic</i> sense.</p>
<p>And usually, when Christians go old-earth or theistic-evolutionist, it&#8217;s usually because of what they perceive in the forensic scientific evidence about what actually happened.  They&#8217;re comparing their interpretation of Scripture&#8217;s testimony about what happened, with their interpretation of what the physical evidence tells us about what happened.</p>
<p>Scientific evidence about natural law doesn&#8217;t even <i>apparently</i> contradict Scriptural testimony about what happened.</p>
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